October 20, 2002

Robin DelBove: Hi All! Happy National Vet Tech Week!! Anyone do anything special to celebrate?

HeidyMemel: Thank you!
JenniferSchultz: You too!
AnastasiaBaima: you too!
HeidyMemel: No
Thom Haig: We had ice cream cake :-)
AnastasiaBaima: I am in a VT program and I got baskets for my VT teacher and got cake and subs. for the VT club...

Robin DelBove: In class this week, we were discussing the single most important factor for a veterinarian to be able to see more patients... and it was staff utilization!
Heather Howell: How many of you are working as techs now? And do you feel like you utilize your skills to your full potential?

HeidyMemel: Hard to say, I don't get any feedback!
JenniferSchultz: I am. And no, I think I could be doing more!
MargaretMoorman1: I am, and I think that I am.
AlejandroGarcia: hello everyone

Heather Howell: Those of you who don't feel utilized what do you think stops you from being fully utilized?
Robin DelBove: What do you think is the best way to convince the veterinarian to delegate more to you? I like to use good examples from other hospitals

DebraCzornohus: I work at a vet school, unfortunately the students interfer with utilization of the technicians
JenniferSchultz: Our DVM is used to doing everything herself (hasn't always worked with a tech)
Robin DelBove: I know of one tech who anesthetizes patients and intubates them all by herself!
AlejandroGarcia: I am a student, and I love to have a tec near to near about the practical experiences
Heather Howell: All of the techs at Carson Valley Vet (where I used to work) induce anesthesia and intubate. It is a huge difference from other hospitals I worked at where we just held patients.

Heather Howell: Let's back up a minute and ask a question. Could we have a show of hands. How many techs are here?

HeidyMemel: I
Heather Howell: !
DebraCzornohus: I'm a tech
JenniferSchultz: *hand up*
AnastasiaBaima: Tech Student
AmyWulkan: Me too!
Robin DelBove: teach techs
AlejandroGarcia: Student, I had work as a tech since my first year
HeidyMemel: !

Heather Howell: How many here are doctors?

Thom Haig: !
AlejandroGarcia: veterinary student, sorry
BethShannon: !

Heather Howell: How many other managers? Raise your hand if you are a manager?

RichardSmolen: Susan Smolen - manager
Robin DelBove: Was
PhyllisWebster1: +manager here

Heather Howell: Okay, just wanted every one to get a feel for who is here.
Robin DelBove: Do you all have staff meetings together with the veterinarians?

HeidyMemel: Once a month
AmyWulkan: Yes - weekly staff meeting for the entire staff
LoriFuehrer: yes, once a month
PhyllisWebster1: every other month.
RichardSmolen: Yes , three of four during the month
JenniferSchultz: Not often, no. Maybe once every 2-3 months.
HeidyMemel: depends, not always very productive.
DebraCzornohus: Rarely

Robin DelBove: That's great! What are some things you would like to be doing that maybe you're not doing now?

JenniferSchultz: More client education. U caths. More inductions (I do some, not all)
DebraCzornohus: Unfortunately, working with vet students I have to let them try everything first. Sometimes it's nice to be able to do things instead of holding animals for them
HeidyMemel: Do ear hematoma surgery and place urinary caths
Robin DelBove: Well, surgery would be confined to the vet, no?
AlejandroGarcia: earhematoma surgery?, Any special reazon why that one in particular?
HeidyMemel: yes, but that's what I would like to do. Maybe I should be a vet. Ear hematoma sx seem so simple to me.

Robin DelBove: Surgery is surgery, none the less. Do you all know what your state's practice act says?

HeidyMemel: We do everything BUT surgery. Our 'new' vet was surprised we intubated cats, cuz he used to be the only one able to do it in previous practice.
AlejandroGarcia: how many years of experience do you have Debra?
JenniferSchultz: Techs/other staff may not perform Sx-this includes cat neuters, declaws or dental extractions.
HeidyMemel: Are dental extractions considered surgery, cause we do extractions.

Heather Howell: I don't think there is any state practice act that allows techs to perform surgery. Some allow you to suture existing skin incisions. But that's about it.
Robin DelBove: In Jersey, we are under the ""responsible supervision"" of the veterinarian and can do anything except diagnose, prescribe and perform surgery
Thom Haig: Some states allow extractions
Heather Howell: Dental extractions depend state to state. Many states allow techs to do them but again you may not ""make an incision"".
Thom Haig: Debra, Do they let you teach the students how to use techs?

AnastasiaBaima: OUr practice act is very simple, but there is alot of actoin around to specify things more between assistant and technician. Our practice aact does not allow techs to perform surgery.
DebraCzornohus: I think they have a class which discussed utilization, however the students want us there for everything including blood collection and catheter placement during these procedures if we are not doing the procedure we are holding the animal

Robin DelBove: How about IV catheters; everybody doing those?

AmyWulkan: Yes
AlejandroGarcia: whats the diferent in a tech and a vet student, as a student, what can I do exactly?
JenniferSchultz: Depends on the case and the DVM. Most of the time, yes.
LoriFuehrer: yes, most of our DVM's cannot hit a vein!

Thom Haig: No, that's what I have techs for :-) Tech place caths, draw blood and anestgetize and teach me to spell :-)

HeidyMemel: This is a question for the vets: Is it helpful to you if we (tech) check in patients, ie weight, temp, short hx?

Thom Haig: I think that is assitant work
BethShannon: Yes, it is incredibly helpful
AdrianKreeger: I agree...that appears to be assistant work

Robin DelBove: How many veterinarians use the tech in the exam room for TPR/short history? We were always so busy ""in the back"" we did not get to do this

BethShannon: I do
HeidyMemel: I sometimes do, because I think it helps the flow of clients if we keep on schedule.
Thom Haig: assistants, not techs, and rarely
NealVillanueva: I just started too. Love it
JenniferSchultz: 1 does, 1 doesn't at our clinic.
AdrianKreeger: No...assistant does that. The technician goea in for blood draws.
RichardSmolen: we do
AnastasiaBaima: in my training. Asisstant work was designated to restraint and what might be called ""gophering"" Techs were in for the physical exam and initial work up.

Robin DelBove: Interesting! Can you imagine an MD taking our temps!! A light went on in this old head of mine!
Heather Howell: Or an MD in a hospital giving you your daily meds or treatments?

HeidyMemel: Very interesting if you put it into that perspective! but then again, vet techs are NOT animal nurses
AnastasiaBaima: wonderful example!
LoriFuehrer: our DVMs would like us too, but we are usually too busy

Robin DelBove: Heidy, explain
Heather Howell: Heidy, can you expand on that....what do you mean?

HeidyMemel: there is a current discussion on VSPN about calling us nurses iso technicians,

Heather Howell: That discussion is ALWAYS going.....or has been since 1989 when I became licensed.
Robin DelBove: How are you as techs introduced in the hosp? I like Vet Tech; we fought long and hard to get that!

JenniferSchultz: I've been reading it.....
AnastasiaBaima: I have been reading too.
AlejandroGarcia: so, you dont want to be call animal nurses?
AnastasiaBaima: I don't we are so much more than nurses.....it is too confining....
HeidyMemel: It seems to me that the term animal ""nurse"" is heavily loaded. I don't mind being called a nurse, but it seems to depend on a plethora of things.
AmyWulkan: My name tag says licensed veterinary technician
DebraCzornohus: I'm sooo over that discussion. We should concentrate on one name for licensed techs, instead of each state having their own title
JenniferSchultz: Registered Veterinary Technician. I don't think ""nurse"" fully explains all of what we do! (I believe, anyways :o)

Heather Howell: So, do you believe that techs duties are not like nurses? Or do you just oppose the terminology?

AmyWulkan: I think we are nurses plus more!
HeidyMemel: Believe me I agree and I don't want to divert from the real subject tonight! Thank you Amy!
JenniferSchultz: We do more than just 'nursing'-we are radiography techs, receptionists, etc.......
Robin DelBove: Well, we are rad. techs, med lab techs., dental techs, etc.
Heather Howell: Anesthesiologists....
AnastasiaBaima: I think VTs have many more duties thathuman nurses do not have and the relationship between Vet and VT and MD and nurse is different dynamics. mostly because vet medicine is a different situation.
HeidyMemel: See, Jennifer's response kind of confuses me, and believe me it is easily done; I am blond. If you are a tech, how do you feel utilized to your full potential if you are acting as a receptionist?

Robin DelBove: Do you work well as a team in your hospital?

AlejandroGarcia: if a Vet works alone, the vet has to do all that too
HeidyMemel: I was just told by DVMs that assistants should do temp, weight, etc. but what if techs act as receptionists?
AnastasiaBaima: At a very small vet hospital in my town, the vet even pulls receptionist duties...it can happen
AmyWulkan: I always believe that for a hospital to run smoothly, you need to work as a team - this means helping out wherever you are needed
Robin DelBove: I think we only act as receptionists as a fill-in and not a regular postion
HeidyMemel: But isn't the question: Where are you BEST utilized to help the team? If I have years of experience intubating and drawing blood is it economical for me to be answering the phone?
AmyWulkan: I don't feel techs should routinely be at the receptionist position - it is not what they are there for - but we should never feel it is below us to help

Heather Howell: Question for the veterinarians here tonight: Do you feel you utilize your techs to their full potential? If so, why? If not, what stops you?

Thom Haig: 90%. Short staffing is the only real excuse for all the other things mentioned above!
DebraCzornohus: How can you excell in your field if you have to do everybody elses job. Techs should be allowed to focus on technical skills
HeidyMemel: Thank you Debra!
AmyWulkan: What about client education - that is just as important in my opinion
DustyBechtel: I am trying to utilize my techs more now. The level of training is the only snag at this point and that is being addressed.
DebraCzornohus: Client ed is one area where I am utilized
Robin DelBove: We have an extreme shortage of VTs in New Jersey; many vets are training-on-the-job because they have no choice
Thom Haig: I agree with all the teamwork comments

HeidyMemel: Elaborate Dr. Haig?

Thom Haig: If I don't have enough assistants or receptionists, then techs wind up doing that work. Almost every hospital I consult in hiring an animal caretaker moves everyone up a step including the Docs :-)

HeidyMemel: What do you mean with ""animal caretaker""?

Thom Haig: We don't think they take care of the kennels they are our first line in patient care then they can be trained to be assistants and go on line to become LVTs :-) We even have a couple ""kennel kids"" currently in vet school

AmyWulkan: We call our ""animal caretaker"" the ""inpatient coordinator""
HeidyMemel: Okay, understand!

Thom Haig: Amy, I think the inpatient coordinator is a tech

DebraCzornohus: Unfortunately, its a vicious circle. No money means less techs that are willing to stay in the profession, which means more OTJ trained ""Techs"" which causes decreased salaries

Thom Haig: Not if vets use on-line courses :-)
Heather Howell: On the job training of assistants with a distinction between their duties and tech duties can elevate teh profession.

HeidyMemel: Question for Thom Haig: What is the most important thing for you in your practice? Money? Client Ed? Etc.?

Thom Haig: Niether techs, nor vets salaries are high enough, but they are improving
Robin DelBove: It's funny you mention that, at our college there are other majors (nursing, med lab tech, surg tech, dental, rad.) and we do ALL that and more and don't get paid as much as any of them!
Heather Howell: Then if the assistants want to progress they can go to tech school - over the internet or in person.
Thom Haig: Most important for me and my practice and our consulting group is patient care all the rest follows!

AmyWulkan: Dr. Haig - don't you think that hiring staff like students helps to cause the understaffing problems because they are temporary help

Thom Haig: Amy, Absolutely not, students and part-timers always have a place besides, most of my techs were students once upon a time
Robin DelBove: Students often turn into full-time employees. It sure helps a VT student understand things better if they work at a practice, too

Heather Howell: We have had many students that have been perfect for the ""busy"" seasons or the high ""vacation time off"" times of summer, holidays, etc. It is great to be a mentor in that training process for tech students as well.

DebraCzornohus: Students have their place and they are a great help, however they should be assistants, not techs

Thom Haig: Not if they are tech students :-)
Heather Howell: Or techs in training. Nevada even has a special ""state registration"" of techs in training allowing them to work under direct supervision of tech or dvm

DebraCzornohus: I learned a great deal as an assistant while I was in tech school, the technicians were awesome they showed me alot, however technician experience was gained during externships through my program

Thom Haig: How many of youhave interns, vet student preceptors or techs in training in your practices?

LoriFuehrer: ! all three
HeidyMemel: We just got a new pre-vet student.

Thom Haig: Great! Keep it up. It builds the profession(s)

ErnieVine: In a busy pract. the amount of dollars paid shouldn't be a problem. We try to pay our techs a living wage. That is defined AS enough money sothey can live on their own.1!
AlejandroGarcia: for how long do you spect to have a student working?, till he/she start with clases again, the whole semester?

Thom Haig: Some work summers. Some schools have formal preceptorships during school. On-line tech schools often require that you are already working at a hospital
Heather Howell: It depends on the student. Some work weekends and holidays while school is in session. Some only summers.

AlejandroGarcia: my summer is in janary and febrary, Any demand for a vet student to work on a clinic/hospital?
LoriFuehrer: we let the students make up their schedule so that it works for them

Robin DelBove: Alejandro, where are you located? We have some wonderful hospitals that participate in our summer VT externship program

AlejandroGarcia: Chile. if I am looking for a job as a student, what should I do, call every hospital?

Heather Howell: Okay, we have a coulple minutes left to wrap this up. Then Thom Haig will host VIN's chat with Dr. Tom Watson ""How to tell if you need a consult"". Any closing comments?
Thom Haig: I want all you techs to know how much we appreciate you! Happy tech week!
Robin DelBove: Let's all be forward thinking - make our dreams come true!!
Heather Howell: I want all of the doctors to know how great it is as a tech to be able to do the ""fun stuff"" and be utilized.

HeidyMemel: Thank you, we (I) appreciate it, but we don't hear it enough.
DebraCzornohus: I just want to say, it is in the DVM best interest to fully utilize their techs. It generates more income for the hospital which makes everyone happy!
AlejandroGarcia: thanks you all for an interesting chat

Heather Howell: Happy Tech Week every one! Thanks for your great participation. Good night.....unless you are staying for the VIN chat.
Robin DelBove: Farewell; heading over to the Tox. course
Thom Haig: we'll give the Viners a few minbutes to catch up :-)

AlejandroGarcia: buenas noches a todos :-)
HeidyMemel: Goedenavond, allen! That's Dutch!
CelestinaDiazdeValdez: Buenas noches

Participants: HeatherHowell, JenniferKatz, ThomHaig, BethShannon, HeidyMemel, JenniferSchultz, MargaretMoorman1, AnastasiaBaima, DebraCzornohus, ElizabethWarren, JenniferKatz, RobinDelBove, AlejandroGarcia, AmyWulkan, RichardSmolen, LoriFuehrer, MaryKarner, AdrianKreeger, JanetTriplett, NealVillanueva, ErnieVine, SusanBorders, DustyBechtel, RebekahSims, GordonMcCluskey, ColeenHarman, PamelaGorbics, BruceBauersfeld, CelestinaDiazdeValdez, KyleLaRosh,